Possible new Bertram 31

[season]

I noticed in the most recent issue of P&MY that when asked in an interview article new Bertram owner Beniamino Gavio stated that the 31 Bertram was an icon to the brand and that they might start the rebirth of the company with an express and a convertible based on the classic 31. He also stated that he might relocate the company to Georgia or the Carolinas.

 

[capttonyf]

Just saw this article as well mentioning some of the same.

http://www.tradeonlytoday.com/2015/02/miami-2015-owner-charts-bertram-yachts/

Tony

 

[Boatsb]

Best ot luck to him. He has good intentions. It would be nice to see the 30 to 50 foot market come back. Hatteras and Bertram were 2 major players in that space for years.

 

[hatteras 1985]

Best ot luck to him. He has good intentions. It would be nice to see the 30 to 50 foot market come back. Hatteras and Bertram were 2 major players in that space for years.

Amazing how the "big three" have abandoned the volume 30-50 foot sportfish and cruiser market in favor of building fewer but larger goliaths in the 60-80 foot range. All of those Euro transoms, fancy hull windows and general Sea Ray styling. Hopefully the new Bertram owners make quality and not pizzazz a top priority. But with a name like "Gavio" at the helm of Bertram, I don't hold out much hope.

 

[pizzazsdaddy]

Hey...Gavio in Italian translates to "Larry"!

 

[krush]

Amazing how the "big three" have abandoned the volume 30-50 foot sportfish and cruiser market in favor of building fewer but larger goliaths in the 60-80 foot range. All of those Euro transoms, fancy hull windows and general Sea Ray styling. Hopefully the new Bertram owners make quality and not pizzazz a top priority. But with a name like "Gavio" at the helm of Bertram, I don't hold out much hope.

It's not amazing. The RV builders did the same thing. Foretravel sold 100-300 units a year of Hatteras equivlent RV's in the late 90's and early 2000's selling stuff that was MSRP from 200-500k (back then dollars). The now make only stuff over 1 mil (really 1.5+). 10-20 units a year. Not a recipe for survival. How can a company attract younger buyers without the money and then have them move up into bigger better models? Oh, you know who does this very well.....Sea-Ray.

 

[Canuck Dennis]

The new generation of "experts" does it their way, the older more discerning types are regarded as outdated in their ideas and design criteria, wonder why the economy is in the state it's in. However, what do we know ?

 

[hatteras 1985]

It's not amazing. The RV builders did the same thing. Foretravel sold 100-300 units a year of Hatteras equivlent RV's in the late 90's and early 2000's selling stuff that was MSRP from 200-500k (back then dollars). The now make only stuff over 1 mil (really 1.5+). 10-20 units a year. Not a recipe for survival. How can a company attract younger buyers without the money and then have them move up into bigger better models? Oh, you know who does this very well.....Sea-Ray.

On the upside, at least Viking and what is left of Hatteras continue to make their product in the US.

 

[capttonyf]

It's not amazing. The RV builders did the same thing. Foretravel sold 100-300 units a year of Hatteras equivlent RV's in the late 90's and early 2000's selling stuff that was MSRP from 200-500k (back then dollars). The now make only stuff over 1 mil (really 1.5+). 10-20 units a year. Not a recipe for survival. How can a company attract younger buyers without the money and then have them move up into bigger better models? Oh, you know who does this very well.....Sea-Ray.

I've been saying this for years. You need to have entry level sized boats. Back when Hatteras was most succesful they had a full line of boats, Motoryachts and Convertible ranging from the 30's to 130'. Not everyone wants a giant boat that requires millions to maintain and crew. They simply want a quality sea boat that they can cruise, fish, and hung out on with their family.
I'm not saying you have to start with 17ft Bow Riders like Sea Ray but be able to pull people in with a offshore boat in the Mid 30's and up. I know a lot of people that would love to see Hatteras build some smaller boats again one day. I know someone will bring up the "New" 45, I'm talking about a New Hatteras not a Cabo Knock Off.

Tony

 

[Steve Mannshardt]

Attended the boat show in San Francisco this past winter. Beneteau had a big presence between sail boats and Swift Trawlers. In addition there was a big Marquis and a number of larger brokered boats. First off nothing was selling. The 50' Swift Trawler was recycled from last yrs show. The Marquis was in excess of 3 mil. Second and most striking was the number of young families attending the show and walking back off of the docks looking completely overwhelmed and dejected. Smart is the broker that shows up at these shows with a few clean entry level cruisers in the 30-50 k range.

 

[capttonyf]

Attended the boat show in San Francisco this past winter. Beneteau had a big presence between sail boats and Swift Trawlers. In addition there was a big Marquis and a number of larger brokered boats. First off nothing was selling. The 50' Swift Trawler was recycled from last yrs show. The Marquis was in excess of 3 mil. Second and most striking was the number of young families attending the show and walking back off of the docks looking completely overwhelmed and dejected. Smart is the broker that shows up at these shows with a few clean entry level cruisers in the 30-50 k range.

Unfortunately, even if a 30K to 50K boat was sellable, boat shows have priced the slip cost to be out of reach to the 50K Listing. In Fort Lauderdale moderate size boats pay between $5 to $10,000 just to be in the show. The only way small boats make it is in a Huge Manufacturer or Huge dealer display. A affordable boat owner or a small brokerage can't justify the slip cost.

Tony

 

[saltshaker]

There just isn't that much of a market for a small to mid sized SF. Viking has added several models in the 40-50ft range but like the new 45 Hatt the price is steep. If you look at what is selling you'll see the big boats are the ones moving out the door. Boating seems to be moving to entry level or ultra high end. Not much of a path to start of small and gradually move up. Silverton is re-introducing the 34C with gas engines with a base price near 500K. Can't expect to get a quality 40ft boat for under 1 mil. The boats we like are not built for the middle class

 

[Boatsb]

What's a middle class?

 

[jim rosenthal]

It's where most of us came from. It's also a thing of the past as far as I can determine.

Fortunately for those who want to go boating in small or mid-size convertibles, better than 90% of the Hatteras yachts ever built are still seaworthy, is my understanding. So for the folks that don't mind getting their hands dirty, there are plenty of them around to fix up and love.

 

[krush]

Can't expect to get a quality 40ft boat for under 1 mil. The boats we like are not built for the middle class

Why is this? Everything is cheaper in the manufacturing world. Why are boats so much more expensive (inflation adjusted) than they were just 30 years ago? It's BS. Banksters and envirowackos. The engineering is all sound and production efficiency is higher than ever. WAGES HAVE NEVER BEEN LOWER! So why are costs so high?

 

[Boatsb]

Because its a 40+kt boat.

Add in the cost of those big engines and all the extras like the gyro and you have a big cost to recover. Hatteras always built a strong, reliable and sensible boat. Maybe my idea of sensible does not do 40 kts. I would think a good 45 could be produced and sold for $700 or so.

 

[rsmith]

Why is this? Everything is cheaper in the manufacturing world. Why are boats so much more expensive (inflation adjusted) than they were just 30 years ago? It's BS. Banksters and envirowackos. The engineering is all sound and production efficiency is higher than ever. WAGES HAVE NEVER BEEN LOWER! So why are costs so high?

Ok consider this in 1965 my old man was Regional manager for Standard and Poors his territory was the Philly area/eastern PA We were by no means rich. We lived in a split level 60's development house that my parents bought new and paid cash.they were able to do so because they lived with their parents for 6 years and saved their money. In 65 the old man was doing pretty well and bought a brand new Caddy for $5k he also bought the 34 Hatt for $22k cash. If you look at the 34 was a little over 4times what the Caddy cost and relate it to today I don't know what a new caddy costs but say $80k for a typical luxury car that would put the same boat in the 350-400k range. My question is what guy in his job position today has $400k cash to spend on a boat?

 

[Boatsb]

Ok consider this in 1965 my old man was Regional manager for Standard and Poors his territory was the Philly area/eastern PA We were by no means rich. We lived in a split level 60's development house that my parents bought new and paid cash.they were able to do so because they lived with their parents for 6 years and saved their money. In 65 the old man was doing pretty well and bought a brand new Caddy for $5k he also bought the 34 Hatt for $22k cash. If you look at the 34 was a little over 4times what the Caddy cost and relate it to today I don't know what a new caddy costs but say $80k for a typical luxury car that would put the same boat in the 350-400k range. My question is what guy in his job position today has $400k cash to spend on a boat?

Smart man. I'm sure he enjoyed not having debt. Today you have to have debt. It's required. It's government enforced or so it seems.

 

[Avenger]

Labor may be cheaper in Asia, but it's not getting any cheaper here. Add in the costs of the alphabet soup of government agencies like EPA, OSHA, EEOC etc. and employing people in the US becomes seriously uncompetitive. Now factor in the low production volume of boats which makes automation impractical and then try to build a quality boat on top of all that. The only way you could make it in that price range is to build a seriously stripped down boat where all the money goes into hull, propulsion and basic systems. Now try to sell that vs. a POS with a plush interior that the admiral will accept.

 

[Boatsb]

Labor may be cheaper in Asia, but it's not getting any cheaper here. Add in the costs of the alphabet soup of government agencies like EPA, OSHA, EEOC etc. and employing people in the US becomes seriously uncompetitive. Now factor in the low production volume of boats which makes automation impractical and then try to build a quality boat on top of all that. The only way you could make it in that price range is to build a seriously stripped down boat where all the money goes into hull, propulsion and basic systems. Now try to sell that vs. a POS with a plush interior that the admiral will accept.

Cheap as hell to make if you use a 3D printer.

Whats all the fuss about. No need to add all that fiberglass. Its just extra weight. Chinaman show you how.