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Starlink satellite internet possible for boats?

  • Thread starter Thread starter MarioG
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MarioG

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Considering that I'm just over with KVH sat TV, not to mention most of the service programming is worthless and all news outlets suck, I no longer am very interested in upgrading my obsolete KVH M5. What I do prefer is having internet service while away and out of cell range.

I wonder if Elon Musk's new Starlink system can be used on-board when it becomes widely available? It seems logical to me that the constellation of internet satellites for broad remote use would be very practical on boats.

What say you?
 
Someone will jump in on the marine market for Starlink for sure.
 
When / where are you out of cell range? Down here while underway we loose signal for about 25nm in the stream, then for 40nm on the bank and while In Exuma park over an another 20nm or so.

Then on the west coast FL maybe 40/50 miles between the keys and Naples. That s about it.
 
Have you been to Boca Chita lately? Horrendous.. don't get me started on this BS 5G crap.. and KVH is simply overpriced for what you get really.

Yes, I hope Starlink becomes practical for boats.
 
Mario I hear you about the Sat TV situation. I have had a Sea Tel dome with Direc TV for years on my boat and it is expensive and the programming is crap. That said it was the best option there in the Caribbean for a long time if you live aboard. I recently tried a streaming service out of the U.S. that works on a fire stick and the programming is really good but you have to have reliable consistant internet with speeds over 5mbps which seems to be a problem here in St Maarten. They will sell you as much capacity as you want on a mobile router but as soon as a few people get on in the same area it crashes. These people have absolutely no integrity when it comes to doing business.
 
Sure hope it makes our way eventually. Could be a game changer.
 
Have you been to Boca Chita lately? Horrendous.. don't get me started on this BS 5G crap.. and KVH is simply overpriced for what you get really.

Yes, I hope Starlink becomes practical for boats.

Yes, been there a few times in the past months. ATT service is ok. One cheaper solution would be to add a cell booster. We have Shakespeare booster with external antenna on La Balsita and it helps.

Agree about sat TV being stupid expensive. Cancelled mine a few years ago.
 
Have you been to Boca Chita lately? Horrendous.. don't get me started on this BS 5G crap.. and KVH is simply overpriced for what you get really.
Yes, I hope Starlink becomes practical for boats.

Boca Chita south of Miami? Years ago I worked for SeaTow K-B.
My AT&T Cell sucked. My new Verision Cell sucked.
One day my girl friend (now wife) was with me and I tried her phone. Amazingly, the lil pocket cheap thingy from Sprint worked great in the middle of south Biscayne bay.
That same lil phone also worked all over the Abacos.

Many years later I know the old cell service providers have merged or been bought out.
I just wanted to say; Different services and/or different phones make the difference in dead areas or not.
Today T-Mobil has been working well for us everywhere,, but here in N Satsuma. Only AT&T phones work around here.
 
Agree about sat TV being stupid expensive. Cancelled mine a few years ago.
I had this dream about Sat TV on our boat.
Never did it, Now never will.
Everything we want to watch comes thru the internet while on the dock.
While cruising, all still thru our phones.
 
Considering that I'm just over with KVH sat TV, not to mention most of the service programming is worthless and all news outlets suck, I no longer am very interested in upgrading my obsolete KVH M5. What I do prefer is having internet service while away and out of cell range.

I wonder if Elon Musk's new Starlink system can be used on-board when it becomes widely available? It seems logical to me that the constellation of internet satellites for broad remote use would be very practical on boats.

What say you?

I think people are comparing Starlink to present day satellite internet connections. But present day satellites are in geosynchronous orbits (they are stationary) and you aim a dish at them (or a tracking dish on a boat).

Starlink satellites are low orbit satellites (300 to 400 miles). This is good news because the communication distance is much less (geo satellites are at 22,000 miles). And as far as the antenna, it wouldn't have to "aim" at a particular spot in the sky (like KVH does), it only has to maintain it's attitude. It receives signals from the satellites currently passing overhead.

The bad news though is that internet is provided from the ground to the satellite and to the user. The satellites passing over the ocean will not be able to see the ground and the boat at the same time. At least, not way out in the ocean. Geo satellites also must connect between the ground and the user, but they are so high in their orbit that they can do this for a very large area.

SpaceX has talked about having the satellites relay to other satellites that are over the ground to make this work, and they do seem to be testing something along these lines on their own boats.

I just wanted to point out that the problem isn't so much of getting an antenna to work on a boat. That should be a lot easier than a KVH unit trying to point at a geo satellite. The issue will be how far from land does the Starlink network work, before the satellites are too far to communicate with the ground stations.
 
Here's my thoughts; I may be wrong about some things and if I am, please correct me. Either way, take it with a grain of salt.

From what I have read and heard, the constellation will be able to relay data between the individual satellites. This has been the premise from the get-go as it's been intended that you'd be connected to more than one satellite at a time anyway, so being passed off from one to another is a normal event for even stationary base stations. Even now with the limitations of staying within your cell, the constellation is in motion relative to the antennas, so what would it matter if you added another ten to twenty knots of movement to the equation?

Starlink uses a phased array antenna, and while I have no expertise with the hardware, I was involved to a limited degree with the testing of airbourne phased array weapons guidance and target tracking systems when I was in the military. From what I remember, phased array antennas usually have a useful beam angle range of around 120 degrees and can change the shape and direction of the beam nearly instantly without moving the hardware at all. Based on what memories I have of what I witnessed in the military and what I've read about the Starlink antenna, there's no doubt that it will be able to track and communicate with multiple satellites at the same time while the boat is bobbing around. I also read somewhere a while back that some guy did the math on the geometry of the constellation and when fully populated, the antenna would only have to shift its aim by 10 degrees to switch from one satellite to another.

The thing to keep in mind is that this is still in the testing phase. Beta is the term used when technology has advanced to the point where consumer product testing is required and is the last phase before final rollout. And really, with a project of this scope, there really isn't any other way to test it. Yes, there are limitations imposed now that make it useless for someone beyond cell phone range or with a moving base station, but that's only because they haven't advanced to that phase of testing yet. I'm not a Tesla/Musk fan by any means for many reasons, but I have complete faith that Starlink will indeed provide what has been promised. Consider too that the DoD is funding the project, which is very similar to how GPS came into existence, and there should be no doubt that this thing is on track.

And lastly, the current cost of about $500 for the hardware and $100/month for the subscription is not competitive at all with terrestrial- based internet providers, but it was never intended to compete with or even work in areas where cable and fiber are available. That you will be able to stream a HD movie while uploading to YouTube and making a Zoom call from the middle of the Pacific is phenomenal and at the end of the day, you absolutely cannot put a price on that. Especially when you consider that the telephone connection it will provide also serves as a backup to the radio if things go pear shaped.
 
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$500 hardware and $100 a month is not much more than what we re paying for a food cell booster and unlimited data.
 
The premise was never that the satellites would carry the internet between themselves (though there are such premises, that isn't Starlink's primary design). Starlink achieves its speed by acting like cell towers. Carrying the internet from ground to satellite to ground and passing the link on to each satellite as they orbit. It is true that they can communicate between themselves, a secondary method, but not anywhere near the bandwidth they maintain from a ground station to a satellite and back down to an antenna. And it isn't a mode they operate in over land, and only an experimental mode they are testing over sea. I suspect that they might be able to handle some percentage of satellite to satellite links at a reduced bandwidth, but nothing like in their primary role, as ground to ground satellites. And this is moot for most of us, as we will never be in the middle of the pacific. We should still have good coverage (ground to satellite to ground) within 100 miles of the cost. I think the service will be successful, though whether it will be profitable at these prices is questionable. It is a vast improvement over rural speeds, but as pascal mentioned, not an improvement over terrestrial speeds, and much more expensive.
 
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